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Lichtenstein cave Y-DNA markers

Felix Schilz published in the year 2006 his PhD thesis Molekulargenetische Verwandtschaftsanalysen am Praehistorischen Skelettkollektiv der Lichtensteinhoehle. (Goetinngen 2006).
The full text of the article (pdf format) is here.

In this work were presented values of STR markers obtained for 19 skeleton remnants of male individuals.
These values are here compared with Y-DNA profiles from Databases od the Czech and Slovak Y-DNA.
At Genebáze, it is the second (March 2008) comparison of Y-DNA markers of persons dead before 3000 years.



Lichtenstein cave is situated West of small town Osterode (South of Hannover), Germany.

Acquired Y-STR haplotypes


Total of 19 males were tested and by 16 of them 6 different haplotypes weve observed. They are denoted Y1 till Y6:

the table si taken from the cited thesis

What are the Lichtenstein cave discoveries telling us ?



Until the recent time the genetic genealogy could use only the results acquired from living individuals to examine male lines (the chromozome Y). Depending on how the particular haplogroups and their subdivisions are spread nowadays it can be presumed, where they were occuring before, where the migration routes lead and so on. However, the methods of isolating DNA from bones improved so much in the last few years that it enabled in several cases to determine the Y-STR markers´ values even for individuals deceased a long time ago. The Lichtenstein cave remainders are immensely interesting for us since they originate from the central Europe and give us data about a small sample of a population of 3000 years ago. So what do these results tell us ?

1. There were 19 males among the discovered skeletons and 16 of them could be used for analyzing the Y-STR markers´ values. Among the individuals some haplotypes occured several times and indicated their pertaining to the same paternal clan. A haplogroup of individuals could be estimated on the basis of a haplotype. In the 12 cases it was the l1b2 haplogroup (3 different paternal clans), in two cases the R1a haplogroup (1 paternal clan) and in one case the R1b haplogroup was estimated.

2. Such a high frequency of the haplogroup I1b2 in this particular area in the time of 3000 years ago is rather unexpected. We would more likely expect a higher representation of the R1b haplogroup. The I1b2 haplogroup is not entirely strange in the central Europe, though, only its high representation among the individuals from the Lichtenstein cave is quite unusual. Today, this haplogroup can be found all over the Europe, but the frequency of this occurrence is somewhere around few percent. Comparatively the greatest number of it is in Germany (and the most of it particularly in the Niedersachsen, where the Lichtenstein cave is located!), Netherlands, Belgium, England and Scandinavia. It is being considered that it has arisen somewhere in Germany or northern Italy several thousands years ago.

3. An occurrence of the R1a in the Lichtenstein cave 3000 years ago is immensely interesting for it demonstrates that the R1a haplogroup did not come to the central Europe for the first time with the Slavic, but that a particular (small ?) amount of it was here already before. Naturally, it would be very interesting to try to distinguish this R1a from that one, which came later on with the Slavonic expansion, but at the current level of knowledge of this haplogroup we are not able to do it so far.

4. As for the only haplotype connectable to the R1b haplogroup, one can say only that it is very close to the modal (most frequent) haplotype of this haplogroup and that in its value DYS390=23 it could indicate its clasification to the subgroup R1b1c9. But this is only a higher level of probability, not the certainty. In any case, this haplotype is a representative of a R1b population, which can be found most often nowadays in the western Europe.

5. If someone would find a genetic distance of his haplotype 0-2 from the afore-said individuals from the Lichtenstein cave, he can take it as an affirmation of a fact that people relative to his paternal line existed in the area of the present Germany in the time of 3000 years ago.

From the hereinafter-mentioned tables it can be seen that the users of our databases have a correspondence with the Lichtenstein cave records only in the case of the R1b haplogroup. In the rest of haplotypes the best correspondence is at genetic distance 2. In this case a better correspondence does not mean a closer relationship, though. We are comparing living persons with those deceased 3000 years ago. A haplotype of their prospective descendants could naturally changed after all this time. To determine a speed of the STR markers´ mutation is a great problem which probably will not be solved in a short time.

An interesting result of the comparison is that only the Slovak database users have haplotypes close to I1b2 haplotypes of the inhabitants from the Lichtenstein cave.


Individual profiles and theirs comparison, matches and genetic distances with users of Czech and Slovak Y-DNA database.



Haplotype Y1


ID db dys19 dys389-1 dys389-2 dys390 dys391 dys392 dys393 dys385a dys385b dys437 dys438 dys439 Match Haplogroup genetic distance
Y1 lc 16 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 - I1b2* (Hapest) -
Y6 lc 16 12 28 24 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 11/12 I2b2* (Hapest) 1
Y2 lc 15 12 27 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 10/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 2
I1b2* modal Ysearch 17 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 16 15 10 11 10/12 I1b2* modal 2
M1273 sk 16 12 28 23 13 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 10/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 4
J1634 sk 16 12 28 23 10 11 14 13 17 15 10 11 9/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 4

Haplotype Y2


ID db dys19 dys389-1 dys389-2 dys390 dys391 dys392 dys393 dys385a dys385b dys437 dys438 dys439 Match Haplogroup genetic distance
Y2 lc 15 12 27 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 - I1b2* (Hapest) -
Y1 lc 16 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 10/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 2
Y6 lc 16 12 28 24 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 9/12 I2b2* (Hapest) 3
I1b2* modal Ysearch 17 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 16 15 10 11 9/12 I1b2* modal 4
M1273 sk 16 12 28 23 13 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 8/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 6
J1634 sk 16 12 28 23 10 11 14 13 17 15 10 11 7/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 6

Haplotype Y6


ID db dys19 dys389-1 dys389-2 dys390 dys391 dys392 dys393 dys385a dys385b dys437 dys438 dys439 Match Haplogroup genetic distance
Y6 lc 16 12 28 24 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 - I2b2* (Hapest) -
Y1 lc 16 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 11/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 1
Y2 lc 15 12 27 25 11 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 9/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 3
I1b2* modal Ysearch 17 12 28 25 11 11 13 13 16 15 10 11 9/12 I1b2* modal 3
M1273 sk 16 12 28 23 13 11 13 13 17 15 10 11 10/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 3
J1634 sk 16 12 28 23 10 11 14 13 17 15 10 11 9/12 I1b2* (Hapest) 3

Haplotype Y3


ID db dys19 dys389-1 dys389-2 dys390 dys391 dys392 dys393 dys385a dys385b dys437 dys438 dys439 Match Haplogroup genetic distance
Y3 lc 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 - R1b (Hapest) -
E1701 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 12/12 R1b (Hapest) 0
K1142 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 12/12 R1b (Hapest) 0
L1538 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 12/12 R1b (Hapest) 0
K1114 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 - - 12 10/10 R1b1 (FTDNA) 0
R1b1c9* modal Ysearch 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 12/12 R1b1c9* modal 0
R1b1c* modal Ysearch 14 13 29 24 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 11/12 R1b1c* modal 1
I1942 sk 14 13 29 24 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 11/12 R1b (Hapest) 1
E1437 cz 14 13 29 22 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 12 11/12 R1b (Hapest) 1
I1931 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 11 13 - - 12 9/10 R1b (FTDNA) 1
J1253 cz 14 13 28 23 11 13 13 11 14 - - 11 9/10 R1b (FTDNA) 1
J1370 cz 14 13 28 23 11 13 13 11 14 - - 12 9/10 R1b (Hapest) 1
K1963 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 12 14 15 12 12 11/12 R1b (Hapest) 1
K1826 sk 14 13 29 24 11 13 12 11 14 15 12 12 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
E1048 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 14 11 14 15 12 12 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
E1156 cz 14 13 30 23 11 13 13 11 14 15 12 13 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
E1336 cz 14 13 29 23 11 13 13 12 14 15 12 13 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
J1639 cz 14 13 29 24 11 13 12 11 14 15 12 12 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
J1233 cz 14 13 29 24 11 13 12 11 14 - - 12 8/10 R1b (GGProj) 2
J1356 cz 14 13 30 23 11 13 13 11 14 - - 11 8/10 R1b (FTDNA) 2
M1027 cz 14 13 29 24 11 13 13 11 14 15 11 12 10/12 R1b (Hapest) 2
E0815 cz 14 13 29 24 10 13 13 11 15 15 12 12 9/12 R1b (Hapest) 3
K1382 cz 14 14 31 23 11 13 13 11 14 - - 12 7/10 R1b1 (FTDNA) 3
M1033 cz 14 13 30 22 11 13 13 11 13 15 12 12 9/12 R1b (Hapest) 3
M1383 cz 14 13 29 24 11 13 13 12 14 15 12 11 9/12 R1b (Hapest) 3
H1314 sk 14 13 29 24 11 14 13 12 14 15 12 11 8/12 R1b (Hapest) 4
E1606 cz 14 13 30 24 11 13 12 11 14 14 12 12 8/12 R1b (Hapest) 4
K1335 cz 14 13 30 24 11 13 12 11 14 - - 11 6/10 R1b (FTDNA) 4
J1962 cz 14 13 29 24 10 13 13 12 15 15 - 12 7/11 R1b (Hapest) 4
K1630 cz 14 13 30 24 11 13 12 11 14 14 12 12 8/12 R1b (Hapest) 4
K1102 cz 14 13 28 23 11 12 13 11 15 15 12 11 8/12 R1b (Hapest) 4
M1383 cz 14 13 29 23 11 14 14 12 14 15 12 11 8/12 R1b (Hapest) 4
E1448 cz 14 14 30 24 11 13 13 11 14 14 11 12 7/12 R1b (Hapest) 5
G0637 cz 15 13 29 24 10 13 12 11 14 15 12 13 7/12 R1b (Hapest) 5
L1411 cz 14 14 30 24 11 13 14 11 14 15 12 11 6/12 R1b (Hapest) 6

Haplotype Y5


ID db dys19 dys389-1 dys389-2 dys390 dys391 dys392 dys393 dys385a dys385b dys437 dys438 dys439 Match Haplogroup genetic distance
Y5 lc 15 13 30 25 11 11 13 11 13 14 11 11 - R1a (Hapest) -
R1a1* modal Ysearch 15 13 30 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 10/12 R1a1* modal 2
E1145 cz 16 13 30 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 10/12 R1a (Hapest) 2
K1445 cz 15 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 10/12 R1a (Hapest) 2
R1a* modal Ysearch 16 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a* modal 3
H1246 sk 15 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (Hapest) 3
J1634 sk 15 13 30 25 11 11 13 11 13 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (Hapest) 3
E0748 cz 15 13 30 24 10 11 13 11 14 - - 11 7/10 R1a (Hapest) 3
E1325 cz 16 13 39 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (FTDNA) 3
E1426 cz 14 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (Hapest) 3
H1235 cz 15 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 - - 11 7/10 R1a1 (FTDNA) 3
I1920 cz 16 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 - - 11 7/10 R1a (GGProj) 3
I2168 cz 15 14 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (FTDNA) 3
K1024 cz 15 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 - - 10 7/10 R1a1 (GGProj) 3
K1692 cz 15 13 29 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 - 10 8/11 R1a (FTDNA) 3
L1747 cz 15 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 9/12 R1a (Hapest) 3
L1519 cz 16 13 30 24 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 9/12 R1a (Hapest) 3
H1224 sk 16 13 30 25 10 11 13 10 14 14 11 11 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
M1178 sk 16 14 30 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
D1549 cz 15 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
E1459 cz 16 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 8/12 R1a (FTDNA) 4
E1639 cz 16 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 - 11 7/11 R1a (FTDNA) 4
I1909 cz 15 14 31 25 11 11 13 11 14 - - 10 6/10 R1a (FTDNA) 4
I1953 cz 16 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 - - 11 6/10 R1a1 (FTDNA) 4
J1012 cz 16 13 29 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 - 11 7/11 R1a* (FTDNA) 4
K1687 cz 16 13 30 26 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
K1743 cz 16 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
K1136 cz 16 13 30 24 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 11 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
L1777 cz 16 13 30 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 4
M1391 cz 16 13 31 25 11 11 13 11 14 14 - 10 7/11 R1a (FTDNA) 4
H1359 sk 17 13 30 25 11 11 13 10 14 14 11 10 8/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
L1787 sk 16 14 30 25 11 11 13 10 14 14 11 10 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
E0837 cz 16 14 30 24 10 11 13 11 14 14 - 11 6/11 R1a1 (FTDNA) 5
E1617 cz 15 13 29 26 10 11 13 11 14 15 11 11 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
H1036 cz 15 13 31 26 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
H1202 cz 16 13 31 25 10 11 13 10 14 14 11 11 7/12 R1a (FTDNA) 5
I2146 cz 16 13 30 26 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
K1381 cz 15 13 29 26 10 11 13 11 14 15 11 11 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 5
L1963 sk 17 13 29 25 10 11 13 10 14 14 11 11 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 6
A1358 cz 17 13 30 25 10 11 13 10 14 14 11 10 7/12 R1a (Hapest) 6
A1632 cz 16 14 31 25 11 11 14 11 14 14 11 10 6/12 R1a (Hapest) 6
C1245 cz 16 14 31 26 11 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 6/12 R1a (Hapest) 6
H1325 cz 16 14 31 25 10 11 13 11 14 14 11 10 6/12 R1a (Hapest) 6


Processed 08.04.2008

Jiří Pavlíček, Ludvík Urban
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